= Сообщение: 4331 из 12550 ====================================== ENET.SYSOP = От : Robert Bashe 2:2448/44 21 Sep 16 16:09:06 Кому : Gerrit Kuehn 21 Sep 16 16:09:06 Тема : Brexit FGHI : area://ENET.SYSOP?msgid=2:2448/44+57e29c17 На : area://ENET.SYSOP?msgid=2:240/12+57dd8333 = Кодировка сообщения определена как: CP866 ================================== Ответ: area://ENET.SYSOP?msgid=2:240/12+57dd833c ============================================================================== Gerrit Kuehn wrote to Robert Bashe on Tuesday September 20 2016 at 19:31:
GK>>> Now you're the one talking like a politician. Who will define what GK>>> is "in the interest of the German people"?
RB>> I'd prefer to define "German".
GK> I'm all ears.
OK. from my point of view people who aren't conspicuous on the street - skin color is not that important, as there are also black Germans resulting from the last war - who speak German, and fit in well with the existing society.
That would eliminate all those who like to wear strange dress (scarves, burkahs and the like) to make themselves conspicuous in public - what they do in their own four walls is their business, since as you shozuld knoe, religion is a PRIVATE matter in Germany. Nuns and priests would be an exception, since they've been with us for many centuries and are part of the normal scenery.
It would also eliminate all those who, although they've lived here for many years, speak little or no German, keeping in their own ghettos to avoid contact with the locals. From what I read, many such people still have no German citizenship even after decades of living here. I have little understanding for such people, and no feeling that they "belong" in Germany.
Basically, as you gather, I would eliminate all those who intentionally and consciously separate themselves from the German society, only too often to claim subsequent "discrimination" - after they have already discriminated against themselves.
RB>> And we go under if we don't place any value on our own history and RB>> values.
GK> "Not placing any value" on it would be the other extreme. How about GK> something in the middle?
And who's to decide what "the middle" is? No, I disagree. Societies evolve, that's true, but they don't evolve in a period of one generation or even two. They didn't call the USA the "melting pot" for nothing. People who emigrated there adopted American customs, spoke English and - at least in public - became Americans themselves. That's changed over the years since around 1980, which I personally deplore, as the relative public homogeneity of the population in the States was a great asset, as far as peaceful and friendly relations in the population were concerned. As in Germany, what people do in the poruivacy of their own homes is their business, as long as they don't injure or otherwise harm others.
GK>>> Have you ever seen someone wearing a burkha? Have you visited a GK>>> mosque?
RB>> Yes and yes.
GK> I doubt you ever saw a burkha.
I can speculate, too.
GK>>> "present problem"? What are you talking about?
RB>> Don't read the news, do you?
GK> I do. But you are vague. What do you refer to?
Now, just think _deeply_ about what we were talking about any you won't have to ask me any superfluous questions.
GK>>> "fairly large minority"... you should definitely become a GK>>> politician. ;-)
RB>> You ignore our "friend" Erdogan, who interestingly enough is allowed RB>> to hold political rallies in Germany. I, for one, would NOT allow RB>> that.
GK> Mr. Erdogan is from Turkey, burkhas are from Afghanistan. Don't you GK> think you mix up some things here?
No. I think you are trying to talk down the problems that have arisen with muslims since around 2000.
No, but you're trying to wriggle out of the argument. Your reference was to a live TV appearance at a mass ralley in Cologne, at which the police feared - with a good deal of justification - violence from the Turkish participants. IOt was NOT a political campaign approved and permitted by the federal Government, nor fif the federal government have anything to do with banning Erdogan's like TV appearance.
GK>>> Could you elaborate on this "trouble"? There is no trouble around GK>>> here.
RB>> You mean Hanover? Possibly. But then, you apparently read no RB>> newspapers and visit no news sites in the Internet. Probably you RB>> don't even know what the AfD is, except for the propaganga of the RB>> "established parties", which would like you to believe that this is RB>> the reincarnated NSDAP.
GK> So please share the first-hand knowldge you apparently have.
Now you're being foolish, Gerrit.
RB>> Strangely enough, a radical leftist party (Die Linken) is not RB>> considered a threat to democracy.
GK> "not a threat to democracy"? They have been under observation by the GK> Verfassungsschutz from day 1 of their existance until 2014.
Presumably you're confusing Die Linke with the NPD.
GK> Their members are still prohibited from becoming civil servants in, GK> e.g., Bavaria.
I figure the "e.g.", meaning for example, is the _only_ state with such a restriction. Which would not be surprising, given that the state is very conservative in its politics.
GK> Strange enough, they are part of the Bundestag and several other state GK> governments.
And are being considered as a coalition partner in Berlin. Whereas the AfD is ostracized by the politicians, although they have achieved remarkable election results. It's really amazing how easily people can be tarred in Germany by calling them "rightst" - true or not. But there's no onus on being a leftist, in fact such people are good company in some quarters.
RB>> People forget so quickly... but I can easily remember the leftist RB>> murders by the RAF in the 1970s and 1980s.
GK> Wakup-call: It's not 1970 or 1980 anymore.
So leftist terror is totally impossible? Gerrit, the Nazis were in power over 70 years ago, and people here in Germany still crap in their pants if they even hear the word "rightest". Leftist terror in the 1970s and 1980s (plus the infamous STSI in the GdR), rightest terror 70+ years ago. That's what I mean by "people forget so quickly". But they only forget leftist terror.
RB>> And of course the leftest "paradise" in the former GdR - such a RB>> "paradise" that people trying to leave it were shot and/or RB>> imprisoned.
GK> I still fail to see how this might be connected with the problematic GK> burkha-wearing Erdogan-fans you claim to exist.
The conversation had drifted to political orientation. Hadn't you noticed?
