= Сообщение: 4142 из 12549 ====================================== ENET.SYSOP = От : Richard Menedetter 2:310/31 20 Jul 16 17:14:46 Кому : David Rance 20 Jul 16 17:14:46 Тема : Brexit FGHI : area://ENET.SYSOP?msgid=2:310/31+578f9e9d На : area://ENET.SYSOP?msgid=2:203/2+57863e70 = Кодировка сообщения определена как: LATIN-1 ================================ Ответ: area://ENET.SYSOP?msgid=2:203/2+578faabe ============================================================================== Hi David!
Sorry for the late reply ...
13 Jul 2016 15:13, from David Rance -> Richard Menedetter:
RM>> By the greater picture. RM>> By the fact that it is a peace project, by the fact that a single RM>> country can hardly stand in todays globalized world. DR> You are never going to get the people in poverty to see that picture DR> when they don't have a job or anywhere to live.
To be honest ... I really do think that the percentage of homeless people that participated in the referendum was quit small.
And it really does not matter. If you look at it objectively there are advantages and disadvantages to everything. The point is to highlight those and let the people make *informed* decisions. This also means that spreading fear, uncertainity and doubt is a bad idea.
DR> Even here in Reading┤we have beggars on our streets which just didn't DR> happen thirty, forty, fifty years ago.
Yes, indeed. The world changed.
The UK does not have any colonies any more. The number of work labour has been massively reduced due to automation. "Video killed the radio star."
And the world is globalized now. Companies are for example outsourcing their support to india, because it is a few cents cheaper.
That all did not exist previously.
DR> And why? Because we cannot stem the flow of migrants to this country
That is a very simplistic view ...
RM>> It was successfully "sold" to other countries. DR> Are you telling me that everyone else in the EU is happy with their DR> lot? That's not what I've heard.
That is also not what I said/wrote ;)
DR> It's only idealists who have simple answers like you and Michiel that DR> believe that.
Hmmm ... interesting view. I had the impression that the leave side has the most simplistic answers in the world. If you went through thos arguments you had the impression that the EU is the root of all evil, and the UK needs to leave as soon as possible, and it will be paradise on earth.
A few hours later, the situation did look completely different. The "winners" did not look that glamorous, and they had to admit that their arguments where not really that true.
RM>> If the price to keep the UK is too high, it is better to let them RM>> go. DR> Do you know, I'm beginning to think that myself!
Well ... the decision has already be made. It is not really relevant what we are thinking.
The important thing is that the Brexit should be executed without harming the UK and the EU any further.
I was quit shocked when I read that ARM is sold to Japan ... I still knew them when they were building 8bit Acorn RISC Machines ...
But the leave side somehow forgot to mention this side of the story ...
RM>> "We send the EU 350 million pounds a week - let's fund our NHS RM>> instead" DR> Sorry, that doesn't answer my question. When have we "meandered DR> around" in the past?
Yes it does answer the question. Before the referendum the above quote. Hours after it, it looks completely different.
That is what I mean with meandering ... maybe not the correct word, I am no native speaeker.
RM>> One would assume that after a campaign advertised itself with RM>> that "fact", that the government would push to have the money as RM>> fast as possible to themeselves. DR> No, sir, it was *not* advertised as a fact. Some people who wanted us DR> to leave said that that 350 million pounds *could* be spent on the NHS DR> but it was pretty soon contradicted.
Anyways ... all moot points.
The UK has decided.
I personally think it is was a very bad move, but it is too late to speculate about that now anyhow.
RM>> Also the NHS claim was retracted the day after the referendum. DR> It was shown to be false long before that.
Still many people did not notice/believe it, and based their decision on this "fact".
I was also quit shocked about the increase of "what is the EU" and "what does it mean to leave the EU" google searches *AFTER* the referendum.
RM>> But it was the reason why many people voted the way they did. DR> No, it wasn't. It was to do with immigration.
I disagree ... but good luck to
DR> The Brexit argument was that, if we leave, then we could control the DR> numbers whereas, because of the EU's policy of free movement, we can't DR> do that.
That is correct.
But it is not "only immigration" it is a complete package.
If you exit the free movement, you also exit all other freedoms. That was not mentioned in the necessary depth.
CU, Ricsi
--- GoldED+/LNX * Origin: Why do they put braille dots on the drive up ATM? (2:310/31)
