On Thursday January 12 2017 14:16, you wrote to me:
RM> But a "normal" user does not have a real tangible advantage from IPv6 RM> today. That is why "normal" people do not demand IPv6, because it does RM> not make a difference for many users.
Indeed. "Normal" customers should not be bothered with these details. My UPC has been telling me that customers would not notice the transition to IPv6. They have been telling that since about 2010. Ans indeed I haven't noticed anything until last summer. No IPv6, no nothing. The they went quiet. And now I have IPv6. But they stopped mentioing it on their official publications. So my IPv6 is "unopfficial". It may be gone tomorrow.
RM> To be honest ... there still are not enough pain points. RM> Most people do not care even when they have CGNATv4. RM> And the big ISPs have large enough pools to cover people who care with RM> "real v4" addresses.
True. My syster lives in a home for the elderlt people. She has a laptop, but no internet connection of her own. She uses the WiFi network of the home. So she is behind a NAT. No IPv6 and so she only has an IPv4 address in the private range. She does not know that. She does not know what a NAT is, she does not know what a public IPv4 address is. People like her do not have to know.
RM> If many people would terminate their ISP contract because of that, it RM> would change. As long as the average end customer sees no benefit for RM> himself, he will not care. And when 95% of the customers do not care, RM> the ISPs do not care.
That goes for the big ones who mainly have consumers as their customers. But the small companies that offer hostng services really have prpblems. Unlike the big ones that presumable still have enough IPv4 in stack (do they really)? the small ones who need IPv4 have problems. They have to buy IPv4 at a cost of abou 1 EUR / IP and if they need a few thousand IPs, they are at a serious disadvantage. They really feel the pain already.
RM>>> The long run is veeeeeeery long.
MV>> Making predictions is easy. Making predictions thay come true is not MV>> so easy. When the predictions concern the future, it is very hard.
RM> true ;)
RM> My current point of view is that the relevant servers for most people RM> (google, akamai, Facebook, etc.) will have dual stack.
Of course. They only need a few public IPv4 adresses to keep those servers running.
RM> And that 75% of the people will not care if they have DS, DS-Lite or RM> CGNATv4. It simply makes no difference to them.
Indeed. It makes no difference to "normal user" my sister.
But I am not my sister. I am not a "normal user" and neither are you. We /know/ something about networking. We have studied, we have degrees, we know what we are talking about. And that comes with resposibilities. We can not remain silent and say that it does not concern us. Yes, it does not really affect us now, but we can see ahead. We can not predict the future, but we can see that a falling stone will eventually hit the ground. So we have to speak up. To our ISPs and to our governments.
The internet is to important a resource to leave it to the market alone.
RM> They can watch Youtube and go to Facebook, and they see no difference.
RM>>> Until then I want my public IPv4 ;) MV>> You may or you may not get what you want...
RM> I am quit sure that I will get this particular wish for a reasonable RM> amount of time in the future ;)
We will see.
RM> I do not really use it for anything on the phone, but it is there. RM> But my previous operator (Hutchison 3g) and my current one UPC both RM> give public dynamic IPs. (Yes even UPC who reconfigured their cable RM> network to DS-Lite)
That seems to be the policy of Liberty Global right now.
We have a couple of people in the Dutch internet forum dedicated to IPv6. You mentioned that customers who are on DS-Lite can be "downgraded" to IPv4 only. Apparently the reverse is also true. One of the guys in that forum got a new modem as an existing customer and was configured for Iv4 only. Only new customers get DS-Lite. But he managed to be converted from IPv4 only to DS-Lite as an existing customer.
So he voluntarily made the plunge. He promised he would report his findings. We will see...
